By Gene Garner, January 25, 2021
For the last ten years, we’ve had an on going love-hate relationship with our GM/CEOs and we are now looking for another replacement for same.
Maybe we should try operating without a GM. Since Dave Johnson was forced out in 2010, we’ve employed a number of candidates that lacked the qualities we believed they possessed. Once hired, they performed their duties in less than stellar fashion and eventually caused mistrust and strong backlashes from the Property Owners. As a result, we’ve gone our separate ways with much regret and fewer finances.
Between new hires, we managed to “muddle through” with temporary replacements in that position. We are now in the process of looking for the perfect candidate– but what if there is no perfect candidate and all along we’ve been wasting our time and money?
What if the different sections (permanent employees) interface directly with the BOD? The November 10, 2020, Organization Chart [see below] shows eight direct reports to the GM along with the executive assistant. Each section has a supervisor that directs their labor and executes the budget. Who better knows the Village’s problems than the people that maintain our common property?
With the sporadic and unsettling tenures of the CEO/GMs these last ten years, these employees have managed to keep our heads above water and the roads repaired. I believe most Villagers appreciate and admire these hard-working individuals and trust them to look out for our best interests. Can we say the same of our present CEO/GM system?
Temporarily sidelining the CEO/GM position would require some adjustments in the BOD, but it also gives us a chance to evaluate our performance under a new system. If it works out, we can make any needed teaks, and if it doesn’t, we’re no worse off.—Gene
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HSVPOA-Organization-Chart-November-10-2020* * *
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Sam Taylor
01/25/2021 — 1:59 pm
No thanks! I think that places too much power into an unreliable board, and that it places them into a position of more direct oversight of day-to-day operations which I would think would require even more time that their present duties. Your other option of a paid management company I feel is more viable than this. The management company has never been my favorite option, but I find it a better alternative than a board run operation.
Gene Garner
01/25/2021 — 4:39 pm
Sam Taylor, even with a General Manager the ultimate authority already rests with the BOD, so there’s no difference in the hierarchy. Plus most of our problems originated with the GM/CEOs because of their power plays and over-reaches and not from the BOD. Who came up with the CMP or the change in title and unrealistic salary demands for the CEO? In my opinion the people we’ve hired for that position have been more concerned with their situation rather than the Property Owners.
The BOD could spend more time on the mundane aspects of the Village, like the street and culvert conditions or the marketing of our golf courses or the other maintenance we’ve put off for too many years. Wouldn’t that be more productive than some of the upheavals and controversies we’ve seen in the last year? The BOD needs to know what those 8 shops are doing and what they can do to help. As long as there’s a buffer between the people who do the work and the Board, they will hear only what the GM/CEO wants them to hear.—Gene
Robert Busse
01/25/2021 — 3:07 pm
I have to agree with Sam Taylor in that I do not think trying to operate HSV without a GM would be detrimental to our community. With the poor track record the Village has had for over 10 years, in choosing a satisfactory management head, I would like to see serious investigation into a management company to run the show. Initially we could have a shorter commitment and if it doesn’t work out then look for an individual as GM as before. Placing the running of the POA on the BOD is not fair to volunteer Directors, who most likely do not have the education, training, and experience to make the best decisions for the members. And in essences we have a new BOD each year, which is much to quick a change in the leadership of HSV.
Erwin Hoeft
01/25/2021 — 4:34 pm
Who will be responsible to fulfill legal requirements?
Andy Kramek
01/25/2021 — 5:39 pm
Do we need another GM? I was asked my opinion of what Mr King’s resignation would mean for the village by a friend who still lives there – here is my reply:
—- Begin —-
The expression ‘up s*** creek without a paddle’ leaps to mind. Clearly HSV is now completely ungovernable and the current BoD has no idea what they are doing, no clear sense of direction and no real plan for the future.
First they promised the GM job to the superbly qualified, long-term resident and then Treasurer, Dan Aylward (who had said he would quit his highly paid job to take on the GM role) but then they decided to hire someone else. (The first ‘someone else’ eventually declined the job because of rumors about his personal life began circulating on certain Social Media platforms). Not surprisingly Dan resigned as Treasurer, sold his house and left the Village.
Then the Board in-fighting started to the extent that we now have only three elected Board members – the others being appointees and they seem to come and go at the rate of one every couple of weeks.
The new GM (with his questionably relevant experience of managing a ski resort in Utah) arrived in August and set about carving out his empire. The Board effectively relinquished all authority to him, giving him a free hand and total control over the finances. In less than 6 months he has quit citing negative comments from residents as the primary cause! Not exactly the behavior you would expect from a Senior Manager running a $35+ Million operation!
My opinion, for what is worth, is that he was way out of his depth and knew it. If you look back you will see that I was one of those who refrained from criticizing his appointment, his salary or anything else in August. Instead I strongly advocated giving him 6 months to see what he could do before attempting to assess him – unfortunately it seems that even 6 months was too long for him.
I am sorry but right now the only option that I see for HSV is a complete change of how the Village is run. Whatever course it takes I cannot see how assessment fees can remain close to what they are now – something on the order of $150 per month is clearly what is needed – but that won’t happen because it requires a vote of property owners! Basically the only other options are either to hand the whole shooting match off to a management company (if you can find one willing to take it on) or incorporate as a city. Take your pick!
I just hope I am wrong in my assessment, but I very much fear that I am not.
—- End—-
My take, for what it is worth, is that:
[1] Past experience suggests that numerous Boards have failed to manage the selection of a GM successfully – with disastrous results all around.
[2] There is no way that the volunteer BoD could manage the POA operations directly (for precisely the reasons that Robert Busse gave).
[3] Management Companies are in business to make a profit (for themselves!) and so may not necessarily have the best interests of property owners at heart, so I would not advocate handing total control to such a company
[4] For what it may be worth, the best option I see is a combination of [2] and [3] i.e. having a management company oversee the operations under the supervision and at the direction of the Board of Directors. This model seems to work for lots of HoAs in other places and might even work for HSV.
[5] If not [4], then what?
*** Incorporate as a city that spans two counties? That should be interesting.
*** Hire another GM. Do the same thing over again and expect a different result – definition of insanity
Just my opinion, looking in from outside as I do nowadays.
Bob Mollerberg
01/25/2021 — 9:29 pm
Gene has offered yet another thought provoking suggestion. Before we hire another GM, suggestions of this nature should be thoroughly evaluated. Our community used to have a RASP (Research & Special Projects) committee. Seems like this & other good ideas could best be handled by reviving RASP. This time set it up with all fresh members, no previous board directors or committee members.
How about it HSV BOD, will you initiate this action?
Bob Mollerberg
steve bylow
01/25/2021 — 10:13 pm
In my opinion it is fairly simple, we need to hire another GM with a breadth of relevant experience like Charles King.
The root cause for past problems was hiring well intentioned folks who did not have relevant experience.
steve
Tom Blakeman
01/26/2021 — 8:47 am
There’s no doubt our system is badly broken. Lots of commentary and ideas lately. Eliminate the GM. Hire a management company. And others. I put mine out there last Spring (https://hotspringsvillagepeople.com/food-for-thought-committees-board/?doing_wp_cron=1611670477.2879951000213623046875 ) and I still support those. Nobody listened.
I have one friend who has been here a long time. He shrugs it all off and says the place has been here for 50 years and so why worry? It is going to be here forever. Maybe he’s right. We also have folks broadcasting that our whole problem is all the “negativity” on social media. Some suggest censorship – just like the national trend now. Prevent anyone from reading or hearing what they don’t want to read or hear.
Here’s my forecast: Our board(s) will continue to flounder. They will appoint some new czar that pleases the current five of them and give him/her another onerous and expensive contract. Power will continue to be vested in the czar with all our bylaws supporting that. We will continue to lose money in various village areas. Another “solution” to raise assessments (on the home owners only) will be put up for vote and the non-residents will pass it. In short, nothing will change.
Gene Garner
01/26/2021 — 9:37 am
Not to belabor the point and attempting to be non-judgemental, haven’t we been without a GM since Lesley Nalley was fired in May 2020? I admit I’m not familiar with Charles King’s record but I’ve heard nothing about his accomplishments and after rereading “Breaking News, General Manager Quits” on this website I don’t see any concrete examples.
During those nine months most of the actions, good & bad, were taken by the BOD. They retired the CMP (good decision) but then turned on themselves and started a purge (bad decision). But they were very active during this period and tried to regain the trust of the Property Owners that was lost in the Twiggs/Nalley regimes. We heard very little about the GM during this time so I assume nothing exceptional happened.
If we can survive nine months, effectively without a CEO/GM, why can’t we do so from now on? There will have to be some organizational changes made and some documents amended but wouldn’t that be better than taking the same path that has failed us these last ten years?
Before anyone asks why I’ve changed from advocating for a property management company to eliminating the GM position, the short answer is I’ve realized how important the permanent employees that take care of HSV have performed. They continue to show up every day to maintain our infrastructure and take care of the organizational functions while we’re involved with our governance problems. The difference is they seem to be very capable of doing their jobs, maybe we should try it full time.—Gene
Tom Blakeman
01/26/2021 — 6:21 pm
Just think. With no GM pulling in $300K in salary, benefits and bonus (in a bad year). We could afford to pay 9 board members a $30K stipend every year. And have a few bucks left over. Something to think about.
HSVP C
01/26/2021 — 7:32 pm
Definitely, something to think about.
Gene Garner
01/27/2021 — 8:31 am
Tom has brought up an interesting question– can we pay our directors for their work?
I believe the answer is yes. Our Articles of Incorporation addresses this subject;
ACA 4-28-215. Compensation and reimbursement to members, directors, officers, etc.
(a) A corporation may pay compensation in a reasonable amount to its members, directors, or officers for services rendered and may confer benefits upon its members in conformity with its purposes.
(b) A corporation may make reimbursement to its members, directors, officers, or employees for expenses incurred in attending to their authorized duties, the expenses to be evidenced by receipt or other proper document.
The Director’s position is a thankless job and puts an added strain on our retirees time. While the compensation won’t be enough to support a family it will, in a small measure, show our appreciation for their efforts. I’ve also, like Tom, considered increasing the number of directors to nine (same as our Supreme Court) to increase the knowledge pool.
Repeating Tom and Cheryl’s comments ; “something to think about”.—Gene
Sam Taylor
01/27/2021 — 9:54 pm
I think that we have shown that we are no better at electing board members than the competence they have shown for many previous years overseeing Villlage operations. That’s my only fear of becoming a municipality – MORE elected officials. Wonder how many more people we’d have running for the board if we paid them $30,000 a year? 😂🤣 No thanks, I’d rather go for the volunteer than the person who would consider just to draw a small salary. I choose another GM or a management company, not a kitchen full of cooks!
Tom Blakeman
01/28/2021 — 8:16 am
You could be right Sam. I really don’t know. But what we have isn’t working. Paying a stipend would hopefully attract those with better qualifications in areas we need. The current situation seems to attract only those with good intentions or those popular but lacking broad management skills or expertise in things like engineering, technology, human resources or finance, maybe even golf. To suggest a few.
If we got over the “Board hands off” policy, by which the board and staff all seem to think we need to operate and our bylaws which support it, we might operate better, not to mention the highbrow titles like Chairman. How about having a Board “President” (a resident owner elected by the people) who handles the role of GM? How about having board members with the skills actually needed? How about having district representatives on the board? East side is different than West you know.
Like I said the current system isn’t and hasn’t been working. If it were we wouldn’t be pondering $50,000,000 in deferred maintenance, money losing golf and restaurants and so many more problems. Just dragging in another big bucks outsider or promoting another home grown incompetent, “interim” or otherwise (because it’s easy to do or feels good), isn’t going to fix what’s broke.
BTW, we don’t need to become a municipality to do any of the things I suggest.
Andy Kramek
01/28/2021 — 9:18 am
Tom, you are exactly right. The current system isn’t working and, as I have said elsewhere, there is a simple reason for that. The people who run for, and get elected to, the Board share a common mindset – which is the one necessary for running a “small business”. Accountants, lawyers, realtors, IT and sales managers all have, and need, that specific mindset to succeed. Their experience and background is either as a one-person operation, a small office or a single-function department in a larger organization (where strategy and budgets are set by others). They have neither the qualifications, nor the experience, to operate and run a complex multi-function business employing over 500 people with a budget in excess of $35Million – and it shows because multi-million dollar operations with hundreds of employees have absolutely nothing in common with the small business background from which most of our residents come.
So, if we accept that premise, the question becomes how do we get people who do have the necessary qualifications and experience to run such an operation? Obviously we won’t get someone by looking among the usual suspects, nor can we expect someone who does have the qualifications and experience to come cheaply. Anyone who could demonstrate a successful track record as CEO of an private company the size of HSV was getting a total package worth around $400,000 in 2017 (according to Chief Executive magazine), today that would mean at least $500,000.
Having said that, I believe that simply hiring someone else and expecting them to come up with a strategy is not the solution. Before we hire someone we need to figure out exactly what it is that we want them to do. That means no more woolly statements like ‘improve golf revenue’ or ‘reduce restaurant subsidies’ but clear directions, couched in objectively measurable terms. Do I have those directions at the tip of my fingers, no. However, we all know what the real issues are and it should not be beyond the realms of possibility to come up with some specific objectives in each of the key areas – Administration (including Finance), Public Services (including Maintenance), Golf, Food and Beverage, Public Safety and so on.
Bob Mollerberg
01/28/2021 — 9:39 am
Good ideas and good intentions continue to inundate this website. But………nothing ever changes. “To continue doing the same things over & over while expecting to get a different result” applies here. Our current & past Bod have proven that they have neither the will or the capability to accept & act on good ideas submitted by the property owners.
It would be good if the Board would at least revive the RASP committee where ideas could be discussed, evaluated & reviewed to gain some traction for action (implementation). If that cannot be done or there is no interest then maybe an ad hoc, & independent property owners committee could be formed.
Gene Garner
01/28/2021 — 10:46 am
From my mid-level management experience in the military and private sector, I cane to realize the best candidates for management almost always came from within the organization. An employee that’s proven their capabilities, that has a history we can look at and judge, usually succeeded when promoted.
We have eight experienced department supervisor/managers with varying lengths of employment that are familiar with our problems and our system. I doubt if any of them would react like Charles King when criticized on Facebook plus they also know how demanding we can be. Hopefully they would be interested in being promoted and not “turned off” by the hire/fire/quit fiasco of the last ten years.
If the majority of property owners feel we must have a General Manager, then one of these proven supervisor/managers should be considered. Bob has some good ideas in his previous post but unfortunately we will still have to cross our fingers and take our chances when we elect the Directors. —Gene
Bob Mollerberg
01/28/2021 — 1:16 pm
We shouldn’t have to cross our fingers & take chances when we elect our Board Directors. These positions are too important, and too crucial to the success or our community.
Could it be that our vetting process is flawed? Could it be that our candidate vetting process is actually the root of most of our problems? Every election, I try to make the best selection(s) by carefully pouring over the resumes’ that the candidates themselves submit.
Last election I realized that all I really knew about the candidates was what they told me. I went to the POA administration and asked what vetting they did on the candidates for the BOD. Can you believe that almost nothing of any substance is being done?
In the working world I came from, candidates for serious management positions were subjected to a comprehensive background check. Alcohol & substance abuse tests were required, along with felony arrest records, educational backgrounds were verified, past employment history including gaps in employment, etc., etc. Maybe the employment world has changed & maybe the requirements are not quite so stringent now. Possibly a HR professional could give us some guidance thru SHRM, or maybe we need to pay an independent investigator to handle the process.
We would be well advised to have our legal counsel guide us to be sure we did not violate someone’s privacy, civil rights, or such. I feel sure that our BOD would not approve funds for such an undertaking so we’d most likely have to take donations to get the job done.
I understand that background info will be difficult to obtain from many years past but not to properly try to vet our BOD candidates is inexcusable.
Please know that I am not accusing anyone of anything but in the words of L. Sherman, “expect what you inspect”.
Tom Blakeman
01/28/2021 — 1:36 pm
Gene. Throw out the names and let’s discuss.
Gene Garner
01/28/2021 — 2:42 pm
Tom, here’s what I have; Rick Middleton, Jason Miller, Tom Heffer, Bryan Garrett, Coreena Fetterhoff, Kim Massey, Jason Temple, and Stephanie Heffer. I don’t personally know any of these employees but I’m sure other Property Owners are familiar with their work record.
Perhaps the first step would be to ask the eight if anyone is interested and then create a panel to interview the applicants. I would think a diverse group, Directors and Property Owners along with an HR rep. could conduct the interviews.
Even though each one specializes in their given discipline, leadership qualities are universal.
Also it’s possible not all of them want the job so the list may be much shorter.—Gene
Tom Blakeman
01/28/2021 — 4:03 pm
Let’s start by knowing approximately how much we are currently paying each of them. Anybody know? Is each making six figures salary already? If so, that would total at least $800K right there plus about 38% in benefits. That’s also a shocking total all by itself. While current compensation is not a sign of competence in and of itself it ought to be a starting point. Are any worth $200K plus 38% plus bonus plus the keys to the kitty?
Next it seems to me we ought to know which ones have the requisite education or other credentials. I know at least one holds a PE license. But that isn’t necessarily a management qualification.
Do any have degrees in Business or Management or an advanced degree from a known university? For the money we pay you’d think we could get an MBA or similar from other than U of Phoenix online or similar.
I agree with your comment on leadership qualities but I don’t even recognize a few of the names. Seems like I would if they were likely candidates. Leaders usually stand out in a crowd.
Gene Garner
01/28/2021 — 7:09 pm
Tom, we would only hire one of the eight to be the GM, the remaining seven would continue in their present job As I said I don’t know any of them personally and nothing about their educations. Keep in mind we’ve used the abbreviations after the names to choose the last four General managers.—Gene
Bob Mollerberg
01/28/2021 — 4:19 pm
On 11/19/19 our Chief of Police ran an employment ad in the Village Voice for a FT Patrol Officer.
Near the end of the ad was this statement: “Selected candidate will be thoroughly investigated.” Perhaps Chief Middleton could offer us advice in background investigation.
If it’s good enough for the Chief, well then???
Tom Blakeman
01/28/2021 — 5:25 pm
Not to worry Bob. We have “HSV POA Human Resources guidelines and policies”.